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Atheist soldier sues Army .
Atheist soldier sues Army for 'unconstitutional' discrimination.
(CNN)
KANSAS CITY, Kansas (CNN) -- Army Spc. Jeremy Hall was raised Baptist.
Army Spc. Jeremy Hall, who was raised Baptist but is now an atheist, says the military violated his religious freedom.
Like many Christians, he said grace before dinner and read the Bible before bed. Four years ago when he was deployed to Iraq, he packed his Bible so he would feel closer to God.
He served two tours of duty in Iraq and has a near perfect record. But somewhere between the tours, something changed. Hall, now 23, said he no longer believes in God, fate, luck or anything supernatural.
Hall said he met some atheists who suggested he read the Bible again. After doing so, he said he had so many unanswered questions that he decided to become an atheist.
His sudden lack of faith, he said, cost him his military career and put his life at risk. Hall said his life was threatened by other troops and the military assigned a full-time bodyguard to protect him out of fear for his safety.
In March, Hall filed a federal lawsuit against the U.S. Department of Defense and Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, among others. In the suit, Hall claims his rights to religious freedom under the First Amendment were violated and suggests that the United States military has become a Christian organization.
"I think it's utterly and totally wrong. Unconstitutional," Hall said.
Hall said there is a pattern of discrimination against non-Christians in the military.
Two years ago on Thanksgiving Day, after refusing to pray at his table, Hall said he was told to go sit somewhere else. In another incident, when he was nearly killed during an attack on his Humvee, he said another soldier asked him, "Do you believe in Jesus now?"
Hall isn't seeking compensation in his lawsuit -- just the guarantee of religious freedom in the military. Eventually, Hall was sent home early from Iraq and later returned to Fort Riley in Junction City, Kansas, to complete his tour of duty.
He also said he missed out on promotions because he is an atheist.
"I was told because I can't put my personal beliefs aside and pray with troops I wouldn't make a good leader," Hall said.
Michael Weinstein, a retired senior Air Force officer and founder of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation, is suing along with Hall. Weinstein said he's been contacted by more than 8,000 members of the military, almost all of them complaining of pressure to embrace evangelical Christianity.
"Our Pentagon, our Pentacostalgon, is refusing to realize that when you put the uniform on, there's only one religious faith: patriotism," Weinstein said.
Religious discrimination is a violation of the First Amendment and is also against military policy. The Pentagon refused to discuss specifics of Hall's case -- citing the litigation. But Deputy Undersecretary Bill Carr said complaints of evangelizing are "relatively rare." He also said the Pentagon is not pushing one faith among troops.
"If an atheist chose to follow their convictions, absolutely that's acceptable," said Carr. "And that's a point of religious accommodation in department policy, one may hold whatever faith, or may hold no faith."
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Weinstein said he doesn't buy it and points to a promotional video by a group called Christian Embassy. The video, which shows U.S. generals in uniform, was shot inside the Pentagon. The generals were subsequently reprimanded.
Another group, the Officers' Christian Fellowship, has representatives on nearly all military bases worldwide. Its vision, which is spelled out on the organization's Web site, reads, "A spiritually transformed military, with ambassadors for Christ in uniform empowered by the Holy Spirit."
Weinstein has a different interpretation.
"Their purpose is to have Christian officers exercise Biblical leadership to raise up a godly army," he says.
But Carr said the military's position is clear.
"Proselytizing or advancing a religious conviction is not what the nation would have us do and it's not what the military does," Carr said.
The U.S. Justice Department is expected to respond to Hall's lawsuit this week. In the meantime, he continues to work in the military police unit at Fort Riley and plans to leave as soon as his tour of duty expires next year.
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dragonfly212 said
I really hope you get what ...I really hope you get what you deserved.
I DO WHAT I LIKE, I LIKE WHAT I DO
MR PAUL said
What Dragonfly ? I dont understand yer statement.... ...NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
labda06 said
"I would rather live my life ..."I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is."
Albert Camus and agree with Camus on this one.
But certainly there should be religious freedom. I wouldn't shove my beliefs down anyone's throat. I suppose when you're in the army facing death everyday in many places its hard to understand fellow officers who choose not to believe in anything. But it is their right.
superdoc said
The more disturbing thing ...The more disturbing thing coming out of this article is that american miltary is becoming a christian organization. There is no better way of making people commit crimes against humanity than making them beleive that God wants them to do it.
Gypsy said
I agree with superdoc, I ...I agree with superdoc, I find it disturbing that the American Military is pushing a Christian agenda.
Visit www.qatarhappening.com
Mis-Cat said
Defenatly Agree with superdoc ...On this one. Sounds to me like there is an agenda here as well, maybe the one "were Christians your Muslim, our god is better than your god" and please before anyone jumps down my throat YES I do know that it is the same god, but unfortunately (and no offense to the Americans on this site that actually have brains) due to mass propaganda in the states mainly driveled out of the mouth of it's president a majority of Americans don't actually know this.
superdoc said
i bet most of them beleive ...i bet most of them beleive they are fighting to pave way for second coming of Jesus.
Gypsy said
I think a lot of them think ...I think a lot of them think they're involved in some kind of Holy War. Hell Bush himself called the War on Terrorism a Crusade.
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someonenew said
In God We Trust is the ...In God We Trust is the official national motto of the United States and the U.S. state of Florida. The motto first appeared on a United States coin in 1864, but In God We Trust did not become the official U.S. national motto until after the passage of an Act of Congress in 1956.[1]
Full article at http://en.wikipedia....
I dream of a better tomorrow where Chickens can cross the Road without having their motives questioned - Unknown
someonenew said
Although I do believe in God ...Although I do believe in God I personally feel that God and religion shud be kept out of Government if you're claming to be democratic, secular, freedom of religion etc.
I dream of a better tomorrow where Chickens can cross the Road without having their motives questioned - Unknown
Mis-Cat said
LOL Gypsy & Superdoc ...I bet your right, Hell I think Bush considers himself the second coming.
Gypsy said
WHAT Miscat!?! You mean he ...WHAT Miscat!?! You mean he isn't!!!!
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brandylady said
If some of the sights ...in Iraq and elsewhere are anything to go by, am sure many others would wonder if there is a God and why he would let this suffering go on.
Platao36 said
Hmmm, this article sounds ...Hmmm, this article sounds weird to me, an Atheist is someone that doesn't belive in God or religion, so, how can someone, that doesn't belive in religion, issue's someone for not respecting religious freedom?
Miss Cat: I agree with what you say, but if we are equal, why does a non-muslim man needs to convert to marry a muslim girl?
So, no, i do think that people are trying to find answers, not the correct ones, but what they like to hear.
Also, as i have said before i ain't christian/muslim or Jew, but at same time i'm all of them, because i'm monotheist. ;)
Superdoc: If they truelly belive that a dead body can be brought to life...eish, wait, don't Christians say there's no life after death?
tssk tssk ;)
Gypsy: What can you expect from a guy that declares a war because "Saddam tried to kill his dad"?
Brandylady: When you talk about Iraq and the suffering, i still remember Kowait invasion, the curdish city that was attacked with poison gas, the public executions i Kowait.
Also remember the destruction of the buddist statues by the Taliban in Afghanistan, the TV and radios destroyed, women spanked in the street because they showed a litle piece of skin, etc....
There shall be the day when all hates will be burried and we Humans can again live together as brothers and sisters.
God/Allah, blesses us all
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
superdoc said
^Someone needs to translate ...^Someone needs to translate that to me to simple English. My English sucks.
labda06 said
Platao36, Christians do ...Platao36, Christians do believe in life after death...if what you meant was reincarnation, no we do not believe in that.
heero_yuy2 said
Is there really a person called an 'atheist'? ..."Everything in this book may be wrong." Illusions: The Adventures of The Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach
britexpat said
I think this guy is just trying to make money out of the ...whole deal...
The armed forces have always had chaplains, yet that doesn't mean the army pushes a Christian agenda..
One thing that people forget is that during conflict and war, many soldiers turn to rligion to getthem thrugh the dark days... Faith is a great crutch to help you along..
labda06 said
Brit, do u ever sleep???? ...Brit, do u ever sleep????
salax85 said
LOL ...LOL
britexpat said
labda06.. ...I only sleep about four hours a day... Actually, I am in London at the moment, so two ours behind you...
labda06 said
good to know u still keep us ...good to know u still keep us QLers company wherever u are.
labda06 said
Come to think of it Brit, ...Come to think of it Brit, thats one serious addiction u have there.
Platao36 said
Labda: I was Christian by ...Labda: I was Christian by birth but now i'm monotheist per my choice.
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
labda06 said
Platao36...your point? I ...Platao36...your point?
I dont have an issue with your beliefs. I was responding to "...eish, wait, don't Christians say there's no life after death?"
a merry can muslim said
Plato... I think you know ...Plato... I think you know the answer to your question to miscat... Because in Islam we have a book that is legislation for Muslims and a reminder as well... And it states in the book that Muslims believe to be the literal word of God that a muslim woman should not marry a disbeliever...
"And give not (your daughters) in marriage to Al-Mushrikûn till they believe (in Allâh Alone) and verily, a believing slave is better than a (free) Mushrik (idolater, etc.), even though he pleases you. Those (Al-Mushrikûn) invite you to the Fire, but Allâh invites (you) to Paradise and Forgiveness by His Leave, and makes His Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) clear to mankind that they may remember." (Al-Baqarah 2:221)
“And never will Allah grant to the disbelievers a way (to triumph) over the believers” (An-Nisaa’: 141)
recognizes game and you're looking kinda unfamiliar right now... -- Riley Freeman
Platao36 said
Labda: Jesus ressurected ...Labda: Jesus ressurected from the dead, but you still say that christians don't believe reencarnation, not an issue, just a friendly discussion :)
Can: Is God perfect? Define perfection, than we talk about laws.
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
dmigtysolomon said
Platao,.. ...what do you mean of monotheist?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
dmigtysolomon said
And in Islam,... ...why only the women are forbidden to marry non-muslim? Are muslim men allowed?
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
Platao36 said
Dmight: Monotheists only ...Dmight: Monotheists only belive in 1 God.
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
dmigtysolomon said
Good Platao,.... ...there is really only one true God and anybody else will be FALSE ones. But you need to find the way to serve him. Believing in Him is not enough. Even the Devil believe in Him but for sure they are not at the same side.
I don't agree with Superdoc, it just happened that US military is fighting mostly Muslim now but only incidental. US is friend to many other Muslim countries so I think the logic is not to annihilate Muslim and push for a religious war. ANd USA goes to war many times and it doesn't involves religion as reason.
USA has the first amendments specifcally to cover freedom of religion so it's hard to mess these amendments.
"dgoodrebel will always be the rebellious good one"
labda06 said
Hiya Platao36...I understand ...Hiya Platao36...I understand reincarnation to mean the birthing of a soul/spirit in another form eg animal. Infact it means "to be made flesh again". Christians believe we are spiritual beings in a physical body so upon death, our spirits leave the body (although some Christians believe our spirits will rise on judgment day), we're not being re-born. We are simply shedding our flesh. Jesus resurrected as a spiritual being so once again, we do not believe in reincarnation. And by "we" I am refering to me, myself and I. ;-)
Platao36 said
LABDA: LOL :) Yeaps, spirits ...LABDA: LOL :) Yeaps, spirits never die, just keep reborning in flesh, a dog can't reencarnate on a human body ;)
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
Platao36 said
Dmight: I already found the ...Dmight: I already found the way to serve him, you serve God by keeping to reach perfection, when you reach it, you'll help God on his tasks. We don't belive in evil, we see bad spirits as litle kids without any responsability. Or you think children are evil?
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
a merry can muslim said
No Plato I will not define ...No Plato I will not define perfection. That has nothing to do with the reason that God has forbade Muslim women from marrying men who are not Muslim....
Allaah has named himself 'Al Quddus' which could be translated to either 'The Most Holy, The Most Pure, The Most Perfect'
Allaah's legislation is perfect.... And we have the Prophet of Allaah, Muhammad ibn Abdullaah who came with perfect guidance...
Game recognizes game and you're looking kinda unfamiliar right now... -- Riley Freeman
a merry can muslim said
Plato you have not textual ...Plato you have not textual proof for that position, do you?
Islam is Allaah said, Muhammad said and the companions understood...
It is not philosophical thinking...
Why would else would God send Prophets & Messengers but to guide the people....?
Why would God give books of revelation? It is for legislation and to act as a reminder to the people...
Game recognizes game and you're looking kinda unfamiliar right now... -- Riley Freeman
Platao36 said
Merry can: With the ...Merry can: With the permission of my muslim brothers i'll explain you what i mean.
If God is Imperfect than he can die right? If he's Imperfect, why should i belive that He sent mortal profets?
God created the universe but to explain to humans what he wanted us to do, he sent other humans?
Ever thought that probably 90% of them aren't truelly profets but ppl pretending to be a profet?
If he really sent all those profets why are there contradictory statements between those profets?
Books of revelation like the Tora, the Holly Bible and the Qu'ram?
What proofs you have that they were given to Mankind by God/Allah?
So, God makes 2 tables with his laws, being one: You shall not kill but Moses and Mohamed broke that law, even Jesus christ (God's son) said "if they slap you, offer the other cheek" .
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
a merry can muslim said
Wow, Plato.. No offense to ...Wow, Plato.. No offense to you as an individual but that is a whole post of poop... Honestly I have to skim it because some sentences are irrelivant to the anything we are talking about....
Look, we only attribute names and attributes to Allaah that he or Muhammad have attributed to Him.
Muhammad was the final prophet sent to you as a monotheist. So anyone claiming prophethood after that is a liar...
Do you believe that Muhammad the final prophet of Islam is a liar??
There are no authentic contradictory statements ....
The proof is in the Quran.. Allah says he sent these books to mankind but that some humans changed the torah and the bible... simple...
Yes, Moses did kill a man unjustly, Muhammad not so.....Allaah forgave Moses as Moses sought sincere repentance.
And I do not accept your statement that you attribute to Jesus... it is from the bible...
Game recognizes game and you're looking kinda unfamiliar right now... -- Riley Freeman
a merry can muslim said
Of course Allaah sent humans ...Of course Allaah sent humans to humans....
Say: "If there were on the earth, angels walking about in peace and security, We should certainly have sent down for them from the heaven an angel as a Messenger." (Al-Isra 17:95)
Game recognizes game and you're looking kinda unfamiliar right now... -- Riley Freeman
superdoc said
dmsolomon Whom shud we ...dmsolomon
Whom shud we beleive, you or the words of a soldier who was seen it first hand.
Platao36 said
Merry Can: "Plato you have ...Merry Can:
"Plato you have not textual proof for that position, do you?
Islam is Allaah said, Muhammad said and the companions understood...
It is not philosophical thinking..."
It's your words not mine, you tell me that Muhammad "was the final prophet sent to you as a monotheist. So anyone claiming prophethood after that is a liar..."
Can you prove it cientifically? Or you prefer to admit that like all all believes you can't prove it?
Don't forget that i ain't a muslim or christian or jew but monotheist
Only God Can Judge Me
الله فقط يمكنه محاكمتي
I am you and you are me, if you love i love, if you suffer i suffer
أنا أنت, و أنت أنا, إذا أحببت نفسك أحببت نفسي, إذا عانيتَ عانيتُ
a merry can muslim said
Plato, honestly, I do not ...Plato, honestly, I do not think you have a clue what you are...
You stated in a previous post that you are not a Jew, Christian and Muslim... BUT you are ALL of them...
Plato, I am sure that makes sense in your world, but in everyone else's world it makes you look a can short of a 6 pack...
How can you not be something, but be all of it as well...
Dude, you really need to find yourself....
I can prove it in a court of law to be true Plato... The lineage is present in the Quran as well as authenticated sayings (hadeeth) from Muhammad. What we call chain of narrations or isnaad... It is there...
There are people today who have memorized the Quran from teachers who memorized it from teachers that go all the way back to the prophet Muhammad. And the same goes for hadeeth.
Like a family tree...
They call it the American dream because you have to be asleep to see it... --George Carlin