A question for all the men on QL....

huh? :-/

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

good answer,WK :-)

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

as long as equality is being aimed for it's alright....supremacy on either side is not good....just my opinion.

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

good answer again,SA :-)

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

people, we are standing at ground zero
of the feminist revolution
yeah, it was an inside job
stoic and sly
one we're supposed to forget
and downplay and deny
but i think the time is nothing
if not nigh
to let the truth out
coolest f-word ever deserves a [Mod Removed] shout!
i mean
why can't all decent men and women
call themselves feminists?
out of respect
for those who fought for this
i mean, look around
we have this
Ani Difranco - Grand Canyon

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

Can I answer too or is it strictly for males?
"It is better to be hated for what you are than being loved for what you are not."

Everything in creation is in balance. Energy has positive and negative, right has wrong, ying has yang, and so on. No male energy can exist without feminine energy and vice versa. It is only working in tandem that both energies can create even cosmic ripples. None can define anything male or female as prime factor. Existance as such is possible in combination of both and not in isolation. You are Indian Saggi and you must be aware of Shivashakti and how it works. Not based on religion but the power and the fundamentals behind it.

On a mundane level it is must be nice to discuss gender superiority or otherwise but if your mind allows you to see beyond what one can comprehend, understanding will come will knowledge of the seemingly unknown but it is the
Universal truth

Svelte.. some time ago I came across a poll taken by a group of men who were asked to decide what they thought of as Sexy. The answer was 'Confidence in a woman'.
I see this as being akin to the definition (posted above) of 'feminist'.
So long as you know one has their own standards and can live up to them.. Go for it. Feminists dont scare me one bit. I think they should be appreicated all the more.
Aint nothing worse than a whiney klingon!

---Why so serious Son? Lets put a smile on that face! - The Joker---

in my life....is my Wife...I don't know what feminism all about :(

In my opinion, women have equal rights as far as she do respect her male counterpart and behave within the social boundaries.

I do support her in all walk of life, considering her best skills and abilities :)

They can never be equal.. There will always be inequality.. right from the day when woman was created!

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Can We Fix It?
Yes We Can!

in a single thread, will plz miss a chance to drag religion???

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A lot of lovemaking can unblock a stuffy nose! Dr. Choc

As long as any female do not start opposing every thing that a man does, I do not think that men should have problem with treating female equally. If females respect their hubby for what they are, men should be willing to do so as well.
"It is better to be hated for what you are than being loved for what you are not."

Like it or not Dot.com but your masochistic religions are one of the main things that have kept women subjugated for so long and still keep women subjugated. You can't discuss feminism without bringing it up.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

equality is civilization

Ummmmmm... All of it. Have you ever read St. Paul? What about Shariah law and how it's dictated towards females?

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Because religion was one of the major things that lead to that discrimination Svelte.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Most of the religions were masochistic and suppressed females for a long time. They were equal in the times of their prophets, but over a period of time became more and more masochistic in nature. Their legacy still carries on.

I don't know the religious stand today but that's how it was in centuries gone by.

"Live with passion, Die with style"

Dot.Com you wouldn't know feminism if it kicked you in the balls, so I won't bother to try to explain it to someone who thinks a law suit against a fast food company is equivalent to what the Taliban do. I prefer to speak to people with a brain.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

To say that a woman critizies everything a man does or that woman dont have the mettle to be like a man is fallacy.
Each person decides their own behaviour and acts accordingly.
Women in certain cultures are raised to believe they should be submissive to men. Men may or may not be raised to respect women.
But so what.
Cant you decide for yourself your ratio with people?
Or appreicate differences?
I mean comon what 3rd world darkage are we still in the shadow of?
Wives or women can be submissive to their husbands should they chose to be so. Yes its tons easier to have a woman like that. Men have an innate need to be the protecors so fine. But give the lady a chance to grow if shes being stifled. That aint too much to ask now innit?

---Why so serious Son? Lets put a smile on that face! - The Joker---

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

Sky is the limit....for One to seek and have skills and polish talents.

I could not restrict anybody's skills and abilities; it is on her to own what she could procure at the best :)

One have to accept the basic biological difference in the structure and mental strength nature have provided to respective gender......

Religion have only defined roles ONE could perform at their BEST!

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

FU,or rather that is QL,eh? ;-)

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

It's really sad FU. Why is it necessary to prove it if something is really good? Good things will be recognized and appreciated sooner or later. Let people decide what they want rather than fighting and bashing everyone else of other belief just to prove the supremacy of their belief.

"It is better to be hated for what you are than being loved for what you are not."

Olive I beg to differ... all arent.

---Why so serious Son? Lets put a smile on that face! - The Joker---

You can definitely state that women are being repressed by the men that are propogating any religion because of the control factor. But one has to understand that no religion is repressive. There are certain incidents in history of any religion that were for certain valid reasons at that time.

Religion has not been allowed to evolve along with the evolotion of mankind just because of misinterpretations to suit the male gender. I wholly agree with you Olive but teachings of any religion are not repressive at all. It is just how religion is being used to control others and women have always submitted to this control.

Similarly masses are being controlled through selective misinterpreted teachings to enforce political and geographical change. It is happening in every sphere of life today.

On a serious note, I think it's the social concept of division of labour that is primarily responsible for the suppression/oppression of women and not religion. As someone pointed out above, religions if at all have only tried to assuage the situation by putting in some guidelines for the treatment of women. The interpretation has been suitably modified by the stronger/dominant gender.

"This is a man's world. Rest all will be taken care of" seems to be the mantra even today. IMO women crying for more rights at a social/national level is a rediculous concept as it only proves the weaker position. Instead,I would appreciate self empowerment through education and proffessional acumen.

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

self empowerment through education and proffessional acumen

Exactly FU. Change will come only through this. I dont care if my wife or my daughter are called feminist. As long as they can take care of themselves and make a life worth living by fortitute , courage, knowledge or education. I will do everything I can to make them independent and strong with human values inculculated.

during prehistoric times when the division of labour was clearly demarcated. they were free to learn and earn. Things changed only because of changes related to external interferences in previously closed societies. The issue of 'protection of women' from foreign invaders led to them being confined to the four walls. Education, as it existed, during those times was never gender based.

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

Hey Olive you are not in Adams days. As I said relgion has not evolved along with humans. And remember even only in last 5-6 decades women have chosen to come out of the house and the fireplace. They were comfortable there for a millenia. And you were not prepared for the world as you are now with education knowledge experience thoughts

So earn your place in the sun . I agree that there is a lot of discrimination and repression but it was allowed and conceded by women for thousands of year. And women were not ready to do anything that was done by man right from the days they had to hunt for dinner

Technically FU, and I posted a topic about this before, while there were hunters & gatherers in Primitive tribes, those were not wholly defined by sex. It was quite common to have male gatherers and female hunters. And I'm not talking about primitive times anyway, I'm talking about the last 200 years in which education of women was considered secondary and was only done to teach them to be wives.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

your post: "FU if we didn't fight for more rights on a social/national level we never would have been allowed to be educated or work in the first place. " to bring across the idea of empowerment of women and whether the demand for it creates any push. I meant to highlight the fact that empowerment comes along with the practices of a society and not because someone is asking for it.

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

As FU said Mehnis, war was what caused us to need men to protect us from other men. This caused men to start viewing us as chattle, the same as their cows, and eventually this lead to formal rules on behaviour being written into law codes and religion. Something which has taken us 200 years to break away from.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

ah now that's a good comment :-)

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How glorious it is - and also how painful - to be an exception. - Alfred de Musset

As long as I am concerned I will give them all that they need in education , knowledge, understanding and inculculate human values. What they choose to do with thier lives is left to them. I am just a support system

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

Everyone comes here for different experiences and to learn. No one can direct anyone's life but best left to chart their own course. Equip them and stand up for them and be a safety net should they stumble. That I guess is my purview

But it is a social/national issue...

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

And thats where I have my reservations. The philosophy has been turned in to a movement by a few opportunists who have made a career out of it.

Source:
- A study Conducted by FriedUnicorn - Vol I (September,1999)

"Resident Attention Seeker"

How is it not? Nationals and societies are made up of women, and if laws don't change on a social/national level then we can't get the education and things we need to succeed.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Hsubands will educate their wives.....wow you are just completely lost on the whole concept of feminism aren't you? FU those things do and have worked, how do you think women got the vote in most countries? Because their husbands one day said "You know, perhaps my dear I will let you vote this year." No. It happened because of protests and conferences and organizations dedicated to the task.

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

So we should all just sit back and accept that we're second class citizens Mehnis?

"We submit to the majority because we have to. But we are not compelled to call our attitude of subjection a posture of respect." Ambrose Bierce

Web definition of feminist - A person who supports the equality of women with men

However, the real life definition is different than the web definition that is why I strongly discourage feminism.